Hi All, I have been looking at the extensive footage showing Serial 31 gliders of Mission Elmira at Greenham Common on the evening of 6th June. Many copies of this footage exist, but there is a particularly good quality version on the AP Archive site, titled 'BM44905-9'. The opening scene shows the commanding officer of the 438th TCG, Lt. Colonel John M Donalson talking to reporters at Greenham Common: Waco #2 is of particular interest as there are a number of ties to aerial photos on the way to Normandy and one ground shot in Normandy. Below is a screenshot from the footage showing this glider with a motorcycle waiting to be loaded: Note that the white tick mark under the airborne numbers of all the other gliders is missing on the starboard and nose positions of this glider - but not on the port side as can be seen later in the footage. There is what I term a 'scuff mark' at the lower left of the numeral '2' which ties it to the scene loading the motorcycle: ...and also to the ground shot with the Norman cows Note that high resolution copies of the 'cows' photo enable the reading of the serial number - 42-77717: This serial number is confirmed on the second line in the Waco listing below for Serial 31 (Elmira): If you look carefully at the motorcycle loading scene in the footage, you will see an unofficial slogan on the back of one gliderman which appears to read 'RECONNAISSANCE'. As can be seen from the Waco listing, this glider was carrying members of the 82nd Reconnaissance Platoon. More soon... Regards, Pat
More from the footage... C-47 marked 'M2-O' (43-15174) is seen taking up the slack on the tow cable of Waco #4. This tow plane from the 88th TCS is seen towing in company with 'M2-F' and a third aircraft over the flooded area behind Utah Beach in two photographs below: If I have my geography correct, Exit 4 (D423) is leading out of the bottom left of the top photo - anyone able to confirm? Below is a zoomed extract showing the serial number of 'M2-O' as 43-15174: As far as I know Serial 31 out of Greenham Common was the only glider mission flown by the 88th TCS on D-Day or D+1, and so, if I am correct, the two aerial photos must be showing this aircraft towing Waco #4. If anyone finds any errors above, please post corrections. Thanks, Pat
M2 - O is 43-1574 chalk #2 in serial 31 M2 - F is 42-100755 chalk #3 serial 31 M2 - D is 42-100753 chalk #4 serial 31 And I am pretty sure that all the CG-4 gliders flew AFTER the Horsas in the formation while their chalk numbers were the first ones http://www.6juin1944.com/assaut/aeropus/en_page.php?page=s31
Thanks Patrick, 43-15174 I presume? Assumed the Wacos, being smaller, would allow a faster towing speed and hence that was the reason they were in front on the ground? Found this photo of Lt. Colonel Donalson on the IWM site: Caption reads: Also, I note from the footage, that Waco #6 has the serial number 43-41438, which must fit in one of the two blank spaces in the Waco listing table above: Note the table is not necessarily showing the airborne numbers in the correct order, albeit Waco #2 is in the correct position in the listing. Regards, Pat
Another observation... I can get the following additional pairs from the footage: M2-A tows Waco #5 M2-B tows Waco #12 3X-B tows Horsa #16 3X-F tows Horsa #18 ('Rose') Although not shown in the footage, I believe the ground photograph below of a Waco marked #10 is one of the 14 from Serial 31, out of Greenham Common: The location seems to be the Blosville Cemetery field. The style of numbering seems identical when compared to Waco #12 in the footage: Regards, Pat
Pat, I agree. The gliders which were part of Serial 31 of Elmira had a chalk number with an underscore. This is great footage by the way. I've seen various segments of it but not in such good quality. Patrick, I really don't see how the Horsas would have taken off first. With the glider formation ready on the main runway, the CG-4A's are in front of the Horsas. Neil.
Another thing... Does anyone know what the number '376' signifies on the Sergeant's life jacket below: I thought first that it was the serial number of the Horsa he was assigned to, but the Horsa listing below for Serial 31 shows no match - albeit with one black listing: Anyone any thoughts? Thanks, Pat
Strange... Serial 31 out of Greenham Common was composed of 14 Wacos and 36 Horsa gliders for a total of 50. The scene below appears to show Horsa #26 at the end of the left hand row: Horsa #27 is shown taking off in the footage, so I presume that glider was the last on the right hand side. That's only a little over half of the force in Serial 31, so are the other half on a different runway? Thanks, Pat
Hi Neil, Would the troops be at the gliders if the full line had yet to be assembled? Anyway, whether on this runway or another, I just remembered, we have some good photos of the other half of Serial 31 taken by Kenny L. Knotts of the 307th Airborne Medical Company - see the 'LZ W Horsa (Knotts Photo)' thread for details and links to the photos. Regards, Pat
Pat, there is footage taken from an aircraft which flies alongside the main runway filming the entire glider serial and all 36 Horsas are in formation.
Thanks Neil, Any idea which runway they are on? I note smoke riding in the distance which might be a crashed aircraft. Its Wiki page here states that in addition to the 438th TCG, there was also two American fighter groups using the field. Regards, Pat
I assume the main east to west runway due to it's length which means the smoke which is visible is due east of the airfield.
Great find Pat. Also on chalk# 10. Didn't link that phto, but did with others, like the chalk #2 which I talked about earlier. And this porves there were at least two cameramen at GC. As the take off was also filmed from the other side of the runway.
HI all, Yes, excellent footage of Serial 31. Maybe I'm just the last one to know, but I noticed in the film that the C-47s seem to have had the chalk number of the glider they were to tow chalked onto their port-side engine. At least in a number of cases. I don't know if this was just something Serial 31 did, or was routine for the glider missions. Couple of examples below: Charles
Yes Pat.. Chalfant and Wilson were wounded during Elmira and they were not in "That's All Brother" but in "Belle of Birmingham", flying with Daniel in lead position of the formation Neil, I have not said such thing. I said that the CG-4 FLEW after the horsas in the formation.. The CG-4 took off first from the runway but after the assembly and while in flight toward France they were after the Horsas And I think I have some proofs of that. - It's said in the diary that Cawthon was in the first glider... Cawthon flew LG687 and was towed by Daniel - Cromie, who was shot down after the release of his glider, was in the 88th TCS and say in his debriefing that he was the last plane of the formation. - The diary of the radar department of the 87th tcs say that Daniel's plane flew the "lead" of the formation. and when they say Daniel's plane it's "Belle of Birmingham", not TaB - Daniel was awarded the DFC. Three men from the 438 were awarded the DFC. Donalson (for serial #7), Richardson (for serial #8) and Daniel (for.... serial #31) - Check the other formations for the gliders missions where Horsas and CG-4A were mixed.. Always the Horsas flew first [hr] Charles I am unable to see your pictures but SOP for glider operations - 434th TCG say, in paragraph 10 : All tugs will be chalk numbered on nose and one foot aft of main loading door
I presume the purpose of this was to ensure the formation stayed together, with the slower Horsas setting the pace? On another tack, is it safe to say that all gliders with the white tick at the six o'clock position are Elmira gliders...perhaps even Serial 31 only? ...and off topic here, but for Charles's quest, I was looking at the footage of the light spotter planes landing at A-6 ALG over the weekend, but cannot lay my hands on it just now. I recall seeing a very blurry image of something in the hedgerow which looks large enough to be a Horsa wreck. The camera is panning with the spotter plane so its only a fleeting glimpse but I just want to check if we have it accounted for. Anyone able to give us the link again please? Its also on the Critical Past site IIRC. Thanks, Pat
Pat, the white underscore is just for the 438th TCG Serial 31 gliders. The 435th TCG Serial 33 had an overscore on their chalk numbers. The 436th just had a bold chalk number (See the Hoatson glider crash as it's a confirmed 436th TCG Horsa and they only flew one glider mission, Serial 32.).
Thanks Neil, Don't have my glider books to hand just now but can we also say that the serials which were in the air on their own did not have tick marks...and conversely those that were part of glider missions comprised of multiple serials did have ticks marks? I am working on a theory that the tick marks were there for the benefit of the fighter escorts to help them find their assigned charges. Regards, Pat
Hi Pat, Sorry about the missing photos. I apparently deleted them from Photobucket. Can't imagine why. Anyway, here they are: Thanks for the advice on the SOP; I was not aware of it. Charles [hr] Pat, Is this the British Pathe footage you were referring to above? You included the linkage to this footage in post #7 of the Elmira Horsa Glider thread. Thanks, Charles